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    Four Pot Callipers???

    Hi,

    Apologies if I’m repeating a question that has been asked and possibly answered many times before. Next planned upgrade on our Stag is brakes and wheels.

    Have been considering Willwood 4 pot front callipers with vented discs and braided hoses front and back.

    Ive been told that Willwoods aren’t an easy fit (Although the work will be done by the garage, think this type of work is above my skill set) with too many adjustments needed. On the other hand BCCP manufactured 4 pots which are a straight swap I believe? In either case there needs to be a improvement in braking force over the existing callipers, otherwise what’s the point? I could just change to a better pad such as Green Stuff.

    What are we recommending.

    For the sake of budget..... Can I upgrade to 4 pots with the original wheels? Logic says do the brakes first then the wheels and so does my wallet!

    Thanks to all

    #2
    Hi Wooly. Do you live in a mountainous region with long steep descents? Have you increased the engine horse power and performance considerably? Do you intend to race the Stag? If your answer is no to all of the above why do you want to uprate the brakes? I can lock the front wheels up at 60mph on a dry road with a standard set up. Uprating will only make it easier to lock up. Remember stopping distance are dictated by the amount of adhesion between tyre and road surface. The Stag does not have ABS so making it easier to lock up will actually increase your stopping distance in an emergency. Many modern cars have more BHP, are faster and heavier than the Stag but the manufacturers do not fit vented discs and 4 pot calipers. Indeed my modern is a large, heavy, 240BHP vehicle capable of 150MPH and it does not have these but stopping ability is tremendous.

    I had new discs, calipers and hoses fitted to mine with the EBC green pads and that is fine. So save yourself a lot of money and grief and go for a standard set up that is new, you know will fit and is reliable.

    Dave.
    Dave.
    Expert:- Ex is something that has been and spurt is a drip under pressure.

    Comment


      #3
      The wilwood kit is straight forward to fit , the only bit of adjustment that needs doing is the back plate, the return edge needs cutting and the mounting tabs need elongating the holes, me personally dont see the point of the BCC calipers ,you go to the trouble fitting a alloy four pot caliper only to keep a solid disc

      Dave
      73 mk 1/2 now gone to the dark side BLUE

      Comment


        #4
        There are some lovely back roads where I live that are such a hoot that even keeping within the speed limit they are so much fun, and generally quiet enough that you could spend all day on them. As Daves comment on the standard system, you could start out on these roads and lock all wheels at the beginning, but at the end they wouldn't stop the car effectively unless you give them plenty notice, been there done it, would have bought the shirt. My 4 pot vented system makes that a thing of the past, no fade, no grab, just consistent powerful braking.

        Pointless comparing modern braking systems with 70/80's cars, todays cars have huge fat tyres with over large discs and calipers, so of course they stop quickly, and if you are clumsy enough to fu** up with them they've also fitted ABS so that even the inept out there don't skid when braking. Fit 185 tyres that Stags are fitted with to your modern and see how good your moderns braking ability is.

        If you want 4 pots, go get em.

        John.
        Your wife is right, size matters. 3.9RV8

        Comment


          #5

          (Fussy) Dave - my answer to the majority of your questions is no! However I see and use our Stag as a Grand Sports Tourer. Owned for 18 months now and have completed a tour of Southern Ireland and 2000 miles trip down to Monte Carlo via the Millau bridge and Montpelliear which included The Corniche roads of the French Rivera and route de Thoenc, where because of my poor driving skills riding the brake, (I have a 4 speed ZF T&L auto box which sort of confirms I’m not looking for the apex of a corner!) I cooked them and when my wife took over the driving, the pedal just fell to the floor! We know better now and in future I will dropped down a gear or two as I would have in a manual. I have plans to tour Italy’s mountains and lakes including the Stevlio Pass,The Highlands, Prescott Hillclimb etc., and with the restrictions of lockdown I have planned far more trips than time and money will probably allow. So my view is subtle mechanical modifications to improve the handling and reliability but still respect the Michelotti styling. Currently, ZF 4 Speed auto gearbox, Electronic ignition, repositioned alternator, tubular manifold and stainless steel exhaust, Kenlow fan, restored rear suspension with KYB shocks and Superflex bushes, rebuilt front suspension with polybushes plus KYB front shock inserts, CDD drive shafts with CV joints, external lighting changed to LED including dual rear brake lights and Town & Country headlights. Others want a ‘Original’ Stag and I fully understand that approach but its not mine. Kindest regards W

          Comment


            #6
            (New to this) Dave - When I was looking at BCC callipers on Rimmers website they were available with Rossini grooved and drilled discs? (But perhaps I don’t understand what a solid disc is....) My thinking was if these were a straight replacement I could retain my original alloys while I save up for some 16” split rims! And then the rubber!!!! But if they don’t show an increased in braking force why bother?

            Comment


              #7
              John You confirm the reason I want 4 pots, my trip up and down the route de Thoenc proves the point, I rode the brakes UP and down with an auto box so when we can off the mountain road into the town , with my wife driving, there was NOTHING. Nobody fault but our own, but I do feel with better use of the gearbox, venting discs and 4 pots its a worry I won’t have again, and we can just enjoy the drive.

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by Woolly View Post
                (New to this) Dave - When I was looking at BCC callipers on Rimmers website they were available with Rossini grooved and drilled discs? (But perhaps I don’t understand what a solid disc is....) My thinking was if these were a straight replacement I could retain my original alloys while I save up for some 16” split rims! And then the rubber!!!! But if they don’t show an increased in braking force why bother?
                Woolly

                When i fitted my wilwood calipers i made shore they fitted with the standard Stag alloys , even though i have now fitted 15 inch revolutions
                73 mk 1/2 now gone to the dark side BLUE

                Comment


                  #9
                  Those who know me will know that I am not shy with the throttle, or the brakes.

                  Standard setup in perfect working order and with aero hoses works perfectly for me. never yet had brake fade on the stag! But I guess I am no longer racing on the queens highway - I might have done that in my earlier years. But locking up the fronts can be done with small effort, never been brave enough to see if the backs will lock should my bravado persist.

                  To OP, nothing at all wrong with modifying or updating your car from me. shiny stuff excites folk I guess

                  Will you see benefit over a well setup OE Stag brake setup on a continental tour?

                  Driving up Stelvio is way more fun than riding the drake pedal down it.

                  Just saying
                  Last edited by richardthestag; 25th May 2020, 20:17.
                  Stags and Range Rover Classics - I must be a loony

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Hi Woolly, you have answered my question then, you do intend to drive up and down steep mountains! So fair enough, you may have good reason to uprate the brakes. I to am not worried about total originality.
                    I have fully poly bushed the suspension, fitted CDD type drive shafts, LED lighting, high level brake light, EWP, sat nav, etc. I drive spiritedly but don't drive in a manner that would push the brakes to the point of fade. That is for the individual to judge whether such driving is safe and responsible with regard to other road users. Good look with the brake upgrade.

                    Dave
                    Dave.
                    Expert:- Ex is something that has been and spurt is a drip under pressure.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      I wouldn’t disagree, squirting up a big hill has got be the most fun, that’s why I want to have a go at Prescott driving day. Hopefully I’ll learn a thing or two before I get to Italy. In France I rode the BIG pedal on the way up also, but in future I will use the gearbox

                      Not everything has to be shiny

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by Woolly View Post
                        I wouldn’t disagree, squirting up a big hill has got be the most fun, that’s why I want to have a go at Prescott driving day. Hopefully I’ll learn a thing or two before I get to Italy. In France I rode the BIG pedal on the way up also, but in future I will use the gearbox

                        Not everything has to be shiny
                        however you do it and whatever you do it in, this is going to be a great trip

                        Stay safe, stay sane
                        Stags and Range Rover Classics - I must be a loony

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by fussydave View Post
                          Hi Woolly, you have answered my question then, you do intend to drive up and down steep mountains! So fair enough, you may have good reason to uprate the brakes. I to am not worried about total originality.
                          I have fully poly bushed the suspension, fitted CDD type drive shafts, LED lighting, high level brake light, EWP, sat nav, etc. I drive spiritedly but don't drive in a manner that would push the brakes to the point of fade. That is for the individual to judge whether such driving is safe and responsible with regard to other road users. Good look with the brake upgrade.

                          Dave
                          Dave the only thing you are missing is bigger brakes....Me an EWP

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Just to confirm, I have Wilwood vented discs, fitted with their callipers & pads.
                            No clearance problems with the standard alloy wheels.
                            And yes, the backing plates DO need the edge cutting away.
                            Enjoy the ups/downs of sunny foreign climes...(climbs !!) whenever that might be...
                            Stay safe,

                            Neil.
                            '77 Tahiti Blue, Spax, MoD, poly-bushed.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              yes you can fit the willwood 4 pots with 14 wheels.
                              I have fitted them as I want the braking consistency of a modern car, after several stops in modern day high speed traffic it good to stop faster than the idiot in front.
                              personal choice, but a full recon set of standard brakes is over half the cost of the new upgrade.

                              Comment

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